Essex Police Branch

FEEDBACKS - REFORM 2

We have received several feedbacks which are specific questions to ongoing business cases, these feedbacks will not be posted onto this site, these questions can be raised at collective consultation meetings or directly to the UNISON lead for the specific business case.

(As above, any queries relating to the selection process should be directed to HR or UNISON and will not be posted onto the feedback page) 

253. I must say that I personally take exception to the remarks under 251. I am at risk purely because of my sickness which, incidentally, was as a result of an injury that prevented me from driving to and from work. Had I not taken that particular time off, I would not be deemed at risk. The exception that I take is that I do not consider myself to be 'second best' because of it, and sickness levels/length of service does not imply that individuals at risk are not good at their job, or are seen as inappropriate to remain in the Force. Whoever you are, please consider what you have said, as it is unjust and insulting to those of us who are at risk. This is a difficult period, and to read comments like that only exacerbates an already trying time.

252. Just to say a word of thanks to Unison, these are unparalleled times, times of cuts, and with cuts comes the anxieties, however, without wishing to be sounding blunt, the cuts will come, end of.
As a result the workforce will have to shrink, yet perform as directed, and once that is understood, hopefully people will see the bigger picture of the impending changes.
It's no good carping on about the inevitable cuts to support staff, the Police service grew and grew, and if it were a business would have gone to the wall years ago, and I hear cries of "oh but we are not a business" - but I’m afraid we are, we are all accountable in the spending budgets to allow the countries deficit, to at least offer a chance of progress towards a healthier economic climate.
As for some of the more recent internal bickering regarding front office staff, had this been in private hands the whole concept of front office staffing, being so essential, would have been looked at years ago.
Put simply when one's on to a good thing, nobody wants to lose it.

251. Why is it that Essex police wishes to only recruit, potentially, second best choices for all of its new vacancies by inserting "only available to internal police staff at risk... " clause to each new vacancy. In this changing working environment I and numerous others are not happy with what has been left to us who were lucky (or unlucky) enough to not be at risk of redundancy. By only seeking recruitment from displaced or at risk staff Essex Police as an employer is not seeking the best candidates for a role but rather a best(ish) fit which is a poor way of conducting business. In this last 3 months I have personally seen 5 roles which I would have applied for, for which I had the necessary skills and desire to not only extract me from a job I no longer enjoy but to progress my career here in Essex Police.

It seems to me that the only options open to me to move within the force are to apply for jobs that no one is interested that are then advertised externally or wait until I am at risk and hope something coincides with my then imminent departure. Consider this, three years or more ago Essex police sought the best candidates from its entire workforce now it only picks from a small pool of staff who have been identified as not desirable in their current role. This must be some sort of discrimination against those who have a desire to better themselves by stunting career progression for about 2 years now.

250. Are there going to be any jobs left in the open pool after the closed pool jobs have been offered as everything seems to be advertised on the pinks at the moment?? Is this one way of getting out of having paying staff mileage?

HR have confirmed to UNISON that staff who are at risk and apply for one of these posts on pinks, will get their mileage paid.

249. Having read 245 and the response from Kevin and Kim I feel very sad that they think that there is no training required in order for a PCSO to work in front counter.
Do they know how to complete a HORT, T28, Section 165, update Elvis? Are they STORM trained or PNC? Having asked some of them that are on duty as I type this I think the answer is NO.
Cleary the fact you're considering using Adecco means you have little or no respect for the people already doing the role, the training they've undergone and the vetting process and obviously think that anyone can do it.
If no training is required then why is there SDA trainers ?
It's soul destroying being undermined at every twist and turn in the job we do throughout this process of Reform.

Referred to Kevin Kirby and Kim Kjolsen for a response.

Response from Kevin Kirby and Kim Kjolsen:

The Force response was not intended to devalue the role, however, once a PCSO has been familiarised with some of the front counter processes it is feasable to deploy. We recognise different staff may require coaching/support. Managers will be required to take this into account before deployment.

UNISON response:

248. I read with dismay the comment the new Customer Care Manager and HR manager said regarding the fact that PCSOs wouldn't require any training to work in the front offices. How did you arrive at this conclusion, did they toss a coin - heads yes and tails no. Have these people got any idea of what the front office/help desk staff actually do? Obviously not or why else would they be treating us like something they've trodden in while out walking!
Why are we being kept waiting when departments that had their consultation after the Service Desk IE Custody have already been sorted it out and don't give that old hogwash about VR as it didn't count for custody.
To me it seems as though they may have made a mistake in shutting and reducing the opening hours of police stations, and are trying to save face by delaying the process and some police stations will soon be back to 24 hours for some and longer opening times for others and putting together another business plan.

See response above.

247. In response to Question 245, how can the Customer Standards Manager agree that there is no set training required to work on the front counter when SDAs have had to undergo mandatory training in order to perform the role to a minimum standard? Are she and Kevin Kirby really suggesting that the role of SDA requires little or no training? Is that another way of saying that the role of SDA is a somewhat minor role within the organisation that doesn’t require any kind of knowledge or expertise? What a wonderful kick in the teeth for those SDAs who have performed the role so far and who will go on to become CCAs.
And when PCSOs perform the role incorrectly which will happen and has happened in the past, will Kim Kjolsen and Kevin Kirby have the complaint put on their own personal files or will they leave the ‘untrained’ PCSOs to face the music alone?

See response above.

246. With reference to 242, Unison have stated that anyone can apply for a job on Pinks. This would appear inconsistent as currently every job on Pinks is restricted to those who are at risk.

There has been an amendment to this and staff at risk now get preference for the first round of adverts, and if successful they are protected on their grade.

 245.  There was an intranet article today saying that PCSOs may be used to cover service desks. At the end of the article it says, "Only suitably trained PCSOs should cover front office." I would like to know what "suitably trained" consists of. 
 Secondly there is a priority of order of when PCSO's should be used in service desk. The second priority says, "Where appropriate seek to offer any restricted PCSO front office work as a reasonable adjustment."
 From my own and other colleagues recent experiences, PCSOs are not allowed on restricted duties. If a PCSO is not able to patrol then they are unable to come into work at all and no "office work" alternative is available. PCSOs can not come back to work until fully fit for full duties. Please can this matter be clarified?

We have referred the query about 'suitably trained' to ACC Harrison. Regarding the query about restricted duties, this has now been changed as per the MOU, and PCSOs may now work on restricted duties in a front office if they are suitably trained. UNISON view this as a positive as it will mean for some avoiding going down to half pay (or no pay) as you might if off sick.

Response from ACC Harrison's Staff Officer: On Mrs Harrison's behalf I have spoken with Kim Kjolsen (Customer Standards Manager) and Kevin Kirby (author of the MoU).

I have been informed that there is no set training that they would require a PCSO to undertake, however would suggest as a basic requirement that they have completed their initial PCSO training and are not still being tutored.  It would be advised that nominees should be supported in working with an SDA for a couple of hours of familiarisation prior to their duty if they have any concerns or they have never experienced any part of front counter duties before. Staff should be encouraged to seek help from PCs in the station or by telephoning another Front Counter/department for advice if they come across anything they are unsure of.

243. Does it seem fair that people with the lowest points due to sickness have procured jobs in other departments?  They have obviously left service desk due to the fact that their points were low and probably would not have kept their job and we now have a situation where they have got a jobs and those with a good score are still waiting.  Surely more should have been done and still could be done to reverse this situation that we now have in service desk.

Anyone was able to apply for vacancies in FIR and Crime Bureau.

 242. Intelligence staff have been advised today that there will be 10 Intelligence Support Officers jobs advertised in the pinks next week. Does this mean that those who are at risk who are awaiting the 'Open List' will not have the opportunity to apply for these posts and that if they choose to apply for the posts that are advertised next week they will not get travelling allowance? Staff awaiting the 'Open List' are anxious and concerned regarding this information. What are UNISON doing about this?

Anyone can apply for any vacancy advertised on 'Pinks'.  However should the applicant be successful they would not be entitled to claim a travelling allowance as this would not be classed as a redeployment.

 241. Please can we have some update and timelines for our futures with Essex Police? I work in Service Desk, I did not apply for VR and I need to know if I have a job or not. How much longer are we going to be kept waiting?

Unison are of the understanding that before letters can be sent out we have to go through the appeals process for VR.  Staff will then be given time to consider preference forms.  There will need to be a short period of one to one interviews then any appeal process exhausted.

Unison believe it will not be until after 1st March that staff will receive their letters.

 240. I have just spent 2 hours completing the Mental Ill Health & Learning Disability Awareness CBT on NCALT. This particular CBT is obviously designed for officers, PCSO’s etc. However, as an administrative member of Police staff there was little or nothing which was pertinent to me or my colleagues within it.
Can I ask why, at a time when jobs have been cut and many of us are dealing with a greatly increased workload, it is appropriate to have all Police staff members taking 2 hours out of their day to complete something which in a lot of cases is completely irrelevant to their job?
Surely a cut down version of this CBT could have been produced to generally increase awareness of Mental Health throughout the force?
Formal response from the Head of Training at EPC:

239. Please can you advise why we were told by UNISON that once we had signed on the dotted line and our redundancy notice had been accepted that we could hand in our notice and we did not have to see out the 3 months notice period, as the redundancy notices state that if we go during the 3 month notice period we will not be entitled to the redundancy payment. As the reform team are now saying that the release of staff may not be until June 2012 what do we do about seeking alternative employment and being released.

Everyone was advised not to resign until they received a letter indicating their last day of service.  We have been advised the letters are due out towards the end of Jan beginning of Feb.

238.Staff in FIR are not at risk of redundancy. Should this not read staff at FIR are not at risk of redundancy currently?

I seem to recall that in Phase 1 staff in FIR were at risk but the Business case was delayed until 2012/13. Does your answer now mean that staff in FIR will not be at risk in years 3 or 4. Cost and time required to train new staff could be prohibitive?
In June of 2011 a general request went out for staff who were on reduced hours to apply for peak time demand posts in FIR, its strange now that the cost of training could be seen as prohibitive.
It seems to be that the force is missing opportunities to save money and also keep morale up in these difficult times.
No one is at risk nor are there any plans made available to Unison to suggest they would be. 

237. Referring to point 229, if it was known that PCSOs were not at risk of redundancy why were they invited to apply for VR.
Being turned down on mass not only shows that each applicant has wasted their time making the application it also wastes the time of those administering the applications and most importantly, may be deeply disappointing to those who could have been looking forward to early retirement.
This is a matter for HR.

236. Re 231 - why have other staff not at risk had their VR accepted when others who are at risk had their declined? I know there is an opportunity for 'bumping' but surely those at risk should have been given consideration first.
Unison would suggest contacting your HR Business Partner in relation to this question.

235. How many people have been granted VR out of the 290+ who applied?

The figure Unison have is 111

 234. Can we have an update on the status of discussions regarding the shift pattern for Service Desk please?

A number of concerns were raised in relation to resilience and staff safety.  As a result two members of staff will start at 8am and two will finish at Midnight.  This information was circulated on 21st November along with the shift pattern and the response to the 2nd question set.  Unison are dealing with issues on an individual basis for members.

233. Further to 231. In the notification received by staff who had their VR application declined it does say that if your job is not at risk you cannot appeal. Does Unison's response to 231 mean that anyone can appeal?
Yes anyone can appeal regardless of role being at risk or not.

232. Why are requests for VR being declined when the organisation has to loose 600 staff. Or do you just like to keep the remaining staff in tender hooks for the next four years.
Also can you explain why switchboard has employed temps to be part of a triage team? Surely these posts could be used for displaced staff.
Staff are currently employed on a temp basis until all vacancies in FIR have been filled.

231. I understand that a number of staff within FIR have had VR applications rejected. Surely if staff want to be made redundant this is better than pushing people? Other staff could be "bumped" to replace these volunteers? At least then some people working for this organisation would have a Happy Christmas and a more prosperous New Year!

Staff in FIR are not at risk of redundancy but can appeal the VR decision is they so wish.  Cost and the time required to train new staff could be prohibitive. Unison support them going on a bumping list.

 230. Should we not have been made aware of exact amount of redundancy and pension sums BEFORE we sign our redundancy acceptance form.

Staff should be in receipt of a recent pension update from the pension provider.  VR can be calculated using the redundancy calculator on the HR website.

229. With the force looking to make cut backs on staffing levels, why are PCSO VR requests being turned down?

PCSO's are not at risk of redundancy, however staff who have applied for VR can appeal the decision if they wish too.

Formal response from HR -

Open list is after the specific pools of the same job reducing have been sorted.  To include a non related job in a closed pool would give unfair preference to those in the closed pool, plus jobs in closed pools are determined by DTS not interview which would not be appropriate for a non related job being included in a closed pool.

227. In departments where staff have had VR refused can you confirm if this means there are no surplus staff therefore no compulsory redundancies.
Formal response from HR -

Yes or numbers coming forward are oversubscribed compared to headcount reduction.

226. Are Unison able to ascertain how many people who applied for voluntary redundancy are eligible for early retirement. Will they be leaving anyway? Will the result of this leave serious staff shortages in the future.
 Unison do not have access to this information

225. Surely with over 600 people's jobs at risk it is a no brainer that all the voluntary redundancy applications will have been accepted - won't it?
Any VR application acceptance will be at the decision of the VR panel.

 224.

We have just been given our final Business Proposal after the 90 day consultation with a meeting with Senior Managers. Unison and HR were invited to attend but for some reason decided not to. As you stated on another thread on the feedback page you are dealing with staff that may be soon without a job and "ensuring the best outcome for our colleagues at this difficult time must take priority". We were those people so, if that is the case, I would like to know what, on that day, was more important than attending. HR turned up at the end of the meeting but chose to go off to another one without even an apology. There were outstanding questions that had been asked of Unison that we expected to be given answers to, which have still not been resolved. I am a paying member of Unison but have felt very undervalued throughout this whole process. I am aware there has been a lot of work to do, but we were supposed to be the priority, I don't feel that we were. We have, hopefully retained our jobs in my department but I don't feel that Unison fought any of our challenges for us, and not attending the meeting was the last straw. I will no longer be a member in the New Year as I do not feel I am valued in any way, and I might as well join the rest of the work force who do not pay any subscriptions but get the same service.
 

Unison were not invited to the meeting, hence did not attend.  During consultation periods Unison have a legal obligation to consult with members and non members alike, however we will not engage with non members on an individual basis.  It should also be noted that Essex Police Branch of Unison have a membership in excess of 60% of the workforce.

 223. Can I ask how much money was spent on flowers planted at Chelmsford Police Station.  With all the cuts do we really need them?

Repsonse from HR/Reform

The plants at Chelmsford Police Station and HQ  were provided free of charge, as they were surplus from a project external to Essex Police and were to be disposed of as rubbish.  The labour used was part of our overall contracted hours, with no additional cost to the organisation. 

 222. When front office staff are in a position where they are about to loose their jobs and the station opening times are being reduced, why are the temporary members of staff having their contracts renewed?  this may well bring them over their 12 month service and potentially bring them in competition with permanant staff for the furture jobs.

Repsonse from HR/Reform

      During times of restructure, employing staff on a temporary basis is a recognised flexible way to maintain business while keeping future options open for other staff members. Each temporary contract is carefully considered before being awarded and only renewed beyond 12 months if considered absolutely necessary. Any permanent vacancy available (occupied by a temporary member of staff with less than 12 months service) will be included on the redeployment list.

  221. What a brilliant time to decide VR!! Staff have up to December 23rd (day before Christmas Eve and a Friday)to confirm or decline acceptance. No idea with what is happening with business cases because........oh that's right no one is telling us! Once these people have decided THEN the open list will come out mid january 2012. The VR people will be given a date as soon as possible......they may extend past April 2012 to June 2012.
Come on what about some ACTUAL answers. Enough is enough. Believe it or not we are adults and some of us are actually literate enough to understand and communicate without stamping feet, sending ridiculous kindergarten emails, and rumour spreading. You must treat us with respect and stop this ridiculous charade. We have lives believe it or not, along with responsibilities. Why do you keep leaving these things until Christmas, you did the same last year with other departments who were under Phase 1. Christmas is a time for families especially. Believe it or not the children break up from school from 16th December in most cases. That means more people on annual leave, probably some of those people will be awaiting VR. How can they respond if on annual leave, and possible responding to people who may also be on annual leave? My goodness I just cannot believe the lack of organisation around this. What do HR have to say about this and why are UNISON and reform allowing this to happen?

Response from HR/Reform

If you feel that you are not receiving sufficient information about a particular business case or your own circumstances you can raise this with your Unison representative, line manager or HR Business Partner.  

 220.  Why did the force decide on the 30th November for all VR requests to be in? If the force wants all this sorted before April 2012 then surely there is not enough time to get it all done and give 3 months notice?

The organisation have been working to March 31st 2012.  However 3 months notice will be given for compulsory/voluntary redundancy which may mean going beyond the original implementation date.

 219. What an utterly incompetent bunch the reform team must be. They have known the number of applicants for VR for months, yet the meeting held on the 8th of this month seemed to come as a complete surprise to them.
And now we are told they will reconvene some time in the future. Next year, no doubt.
Quite clearly, this is something worth stringing out for as long as possible as it keeps senior officers away from their real jobs.
And even more clearly, Essex Police does not give two hoots about the well-being of its employees.
If they worked in the real world, the whole lot would have been sacked months ago.
Disgusting!! Words fail me.
 

218. Could the Essex Police Voluntary Redundancy Panel please give staff a clearer idea of when they are going to reconvene to process the remaining applications? For staff who have already experienced delays in their Business Cases, additional delay in VR decisions is very frustrating, stressful and unsettling.
 Unison have been informed the panel reconvened yesterday.  Staff should be informed in the next few days of the outcome.

217. Have just read the Intranet article regarding the VR Panel. What a suprise!!! NOT. We have been let down again. The 290 applicants surely did not all submit for VR on the same day and some must have been pre the October Panel - so was nothing done in October or is it down to poor time management skills? Also why have we not been told when the next panel is going to be held - "earliest opportunity" is not good enough. This is unfair treatment.
 

 216. Reference to question 191.  Can you give the 'ratio of members to non members' please.

Essex Police Branch of Unison have in excess of 60% membership.  We cannot be more specific as this changes constantly.

 215. Can someone explain what bumping means?

If a member of staff applies for VR but is not at risk and their post will be put on the open list of vacancies, someone who is at risk can apply for the post and be 'bumped' into it subject to it being a similar role.

 214. Scenes of Crime Admin Assistants.
This post has already been removed from Chelmsford as it was classed as unnecessary. However if total up the hours spent by qualified SOCO officers completing office admin tasks, many of which are required for continuity this appears to be in excess of the 37 hour saving. Surely not a saving and also a breach of employment law
 

Unfortunately this is not a breach of employment law as the work is being completed by more than one person.  It Would only be a breach if someone was employed specifically to do the role.  
  

 213. Further to points 203, 208, and 210.  I refer to HR's response regarding car parking. With the greatest respect, I cannot see that posting a message on the intranet would amount to a great deal of bureaucracy. In fact, I am happy to do it myself. The information is centralised - via the Head of Property Services, whose staff do the actual coning. All he would need to do is copy me in to any requests for coning - I will then put a notice on the intranet. It's as simple as that and for those of us (unlike many who work in HR) who do NOT have an allocated parking space, it will of course not solve the problem but it will give us a day's notice so that we know we need to park elsewhere.
 
I'm disappointed that the ACC has no opinion on the matter since, as I said before, this affects many members of staff AND departments. It is very little effort for quite a substantial gain and I urge anybody who agrees with me to put a message on this bulletin board and/or contact your line manager to urge them to do the same. A little bit of common sense is always welcome.

Staff in the Unison office are currently dealing with in excess of 600 staff during the current restructure, many of whom are at risk of losing their jobs. Whilst Unison acknowledges the car parking situation is very frustrating we must not lose sight of the fact that many of our colleagues may not have a job with the organisation in the coming months. I'm sure we are all agreed that ensuring the best outcome for our colleagues at this difficult time must take priority.  Therefore Unison cannot enter into any further correspondance on the subject of parking at HQ.

 212. With regards to point 205 - Do we know if anything has been put forward to the Government to protect the Pensions for workers with say 10 or more years service? Would it not be prudent to change the Pensions of those joining public sector services now!
 
Please see answer to point 205.

211a. In response to 211 please can you tell me why this is only being challenged now?  I and many of my colleagues have sent numerous e mails to both Unison and HR and posted comments on this site (none which were printed) regarding this issue. It was also mentioned at both our initial meetings on 23/08 and again on with Unison on 07/09 but still no one seemed to be taking the issue seriously. I know front counter staff are considered the lowest of low but we do all pay are union fees and for what. For the Union to eventually challenge it when they know if it goes to grievance by the time it’s dealt with the temps would have been here twelve months and therefore permanent. It’s not the temp’s faults either that their contracts have been managed so poorly.

211. When front office staff are in a position where they are about to lose their jobs and the station opening times are being reduced, why are the temporary members of staff having their contracts renewed?  This may well bring them over their 12 month service and potentially bring them in competition with permanant staff for future jobs.

 Unison are currently challenging this with the head of HR and are awaiting a response.

 210.  Further to points 203 and 208 regarding parking: as i have pointed out elsewhere, we all understand that (a) it's a right not a privilege and (b) those who are mileage users and/or disabled must take priority over the rest over us. However, it would be interesting to know how many of those currently parking at HQ and Orchard car parks fall into either category and how many are there because of previous roles or because they 'know' somebody. Furthermore, I made the point to Property Services that it is only a matter of courtesy to give notice when when whole areas are going to be coned off. The head of Property Services agrees - but though his staff do the coning off, he does not think it is his department's responsibility to advise car park users. The upshot is that the responsibility lies with the department requesting the car parking spaces - and since there seems to be no policy on this, we depend largely on the goodwill of the department involved as
to whether or not we are given notice. It cannot be beyond the wit of this organisation to devise some kind of process whereby SOMEBODY notifies the rest of us when we are going to be subject to this inconvenience? It shouldn't be forgotten that it's not just individuals but departments which are inconvenienced when staff members are driving around in circles. Perhaps our ACCs have a view on this?

209. Can Reform please explain why police officers are still being given vehicle response courses when they have been posted to an A.I.T. post. The officers were advised 19/10/2011 of their postings, there would have been plenty of time to cancel officers who would no long require to be response drivers. I am aware that a response course has just been completed and of an officer who will be in a A.I.T. post. How much does a 3 week response course cost? And what has happended to cost cutting measures.